Rats on the OT?

[scubabob]

i have been in many a bush situation and slept with some nasty critters in my time (not the ex gf's) but someone recently told me about rats and mice chewing through tents and backpacks to get at tucker on the Overland Track. As i plan to do this walk next year and i don't mind any critter, i have a distinct loathing for both rats and mice - can't stand them! I have no desire to set up a perimeter around my tent with Claymore mines and assorted booby traps, so can someone please set the record straight - is this the case or is someone having a lend of me?

[Son of a Beach]

I've not seen introduced rats on the track myself, but I've been led to believe they are there, particularly at the huts. There's certainly plenty in other parts of Tasmania, and they're hardy little critters capable of surviving anywhere people leave food (or other rubbish) around for them.

I have seen the native rats eating our porridge scraps out of the bowls at camp sites before we did the washing up.

So although I've never seen introduced rats while bushwalking, I reckon there probably are some in some locations. However, I'm also sure that some people confuse the native rats.

I guess it also depends on your definition of the common name, 'rat'. Most people mean the common introduced rats, 'Rattus norvegicus' and 'Rattus rattus'. The is a native Tasmanian 'swamp rat', with the latin name, 'Rattus lutreolus'.

(There's also a native Tasmanian water rat, 'Hydromys chrysogaster', but they're a little more distinctive).

EDIT: Just to clarify... I think that the reason I've never seen any rodents (native or otherwise) in huts, is probably because I don't use the huts often. The only rodents I've seen are the native ones (I think) at camp sites nowhere near any huts. The one that sprints to mind is the camp site at Lake Cygnus in the Western Arthurs where my father got a good photo of it eating from his porridge bowl (analog, otherwise, I'd post it here).

[norts]

Last time I was at Pine Valley you could lift the top on the toilet and watch the mice scurry away. As soon as you closed the top they would be back.
You wouldn't want those little feet walking over your food bowl.
I have had the most problems with possums on the OT. Always take a stick and some rocks to bed if you are sleeping on the tent platforms.

Roger

[tasadam]

I had a good discussion with Parks rangers a while back on this.
The biggest problem with vermin is that people do things like throw foodscraps into the composting toilet, which attracts them.
Also not cleaning up around themselves in the huts is a big attracter.
And we all know they like huts - Echo Point has a reputation, and indeed I believe some subtle baiting has been done there. Pine Valley hut is active, as is Narcissus hut (we had to use the top bunks and be creative with our storage), and High Camp hut on Mt Eliza has a little antichinus or some such living there -



The mice we saw at Narcissus looked more like the typical house mouse, but it could have been native, I'm no expert.

I wonder about hygiene issues with these rodents feeding on foodscraps thrown down composting toilets and then living in / wandering through huts.

I noticed on the first 3 days of the Overland track, someone had thrown down a couple of whole carrots, a few celery sticks, then I think it was apples on thge 3rd day. I reckon I know who but won't name them, suffice to say it was a school group.

I also noticed at Windy Ridge, some idiot had thrown food in the toilet there, plastic bag and all.
And we wonder why there are resident vermons in the huts?

So long as you store your gear wisely you shouldn't have too much difficulty with rodents - hang your packs so they can't climb along rafters and get to it - bring some builders line or some such strong nylon string so they can't climb it. Worked for us!
On the OT, I haven't heard of rats but certainly mice / mice sized critters.

Here's the Parks sites on rodents...
http://www.parks.tas.gov.au/wildlife/ma ... dents.html

Fact sheet - click to open, or right-click - save as (PDF file) - http://www.parks.tas.gov.au/factsheets/ ... odents.pdf
(comes from http://www.parks.tas.gov.au/factsheets/ - worth a look)

For the latest information on how to manage yourself against the rodents of the park, my advice would be to call the ranger office in either Cradle or Lake St Clair and have a chat with them. If you get someone that "isn't sure" (more likely in Cradle), ask for a senior ranger or someone that might know how bad the problem currently is - they generally get a good bit of feedback. As most people walk Cradle to L.St Clair, it might be better calling St Clair. I've always found parks staff great to talk to and up with the latest. Though I have heard someone comment negatively on an experience at Cradle with what seemed more like a temp worker - not first hand so can't verify. I don't generally like to bag out Parks.

Now if you are camping in your tent, introduce the possum problem. People unwisely feed them and they get used to humans - so much so that you can find them climbing under your tent vestuble if you are sitting two metres away and have your back turned.
If you are sleeping and have things stored in your vestuble, sit your billy on top so if you wake up to the sound of your billy tumbling about, bash and shake the tent and make a bit of noise. Has worked for me in the past.
Off topic - funny thing, I was camped at Lake Cygnus on Western Arthurs and woke up in the night to what sounded like a possum poking around the vestuble. Shook the tent & made a noise, all well, back to sleep.
Next morning er woke up to a couple of inches of snow and the "possum" I heard would have been snow sliding off the tent in the night.

[johnw]

"not cleaning up around themselves in the huts is a big attracter."

"And we all know they like huts - Echo Point has a reputation, and indeed I believe some subtle baiting has been done there. Pine Valley hut is active"

"store your gear wisely you shouldn't have too much difficulty with rodents"

"ask for a senior ranger or someone that might know how bad the problem currently is - they generally get a good bit of feedback. As most people walk Cradle to L.St Clair, it might be better calling St Clair"

I suspect the quolls around Kitchen Hut are due to the "not cleaning up" syndrome. Everyone turns up there for lunch, innocently drop crumbs on the floor then leave. Quolls patrol the hut floor looking for an easy snack.

I'd read about the problems at Echo Point. However, final stages of the OT early January, we stayed at both Pine Valley and Echo Point huts. Didn't experience any rats or other furry creatures. Kept all food double wrapped in zip lock bags inside a large dry bag. I guess that may have helped. No one else in the hut at Echo Point, but one guy snoring non-stop at about 100 decibels at Pine Valley may have kept the wildlife at bay. I did hear what sounded like a devil near the toilet during a midnight nature call, but that may have been my imagination .

I think the hut log books, and when people sign out at Lake St Clair, would be a good source of feedback.

[tasadam]

...the hut log books would be a good source of feedback.

Definitely! Plenty of info in them, though you have to get there to know what you're up against.

Also some sketches of them from people stuck on a bad weather day.

I wonder what Parks do with the old log books? Would make for some interesting reading.

[Son of a Beach]

I agree that possums are more of a problem than rats (at least in my experience). They are capable of causing serious damage to tents, and can get into packs. They'll sometimes come right into the tent vestibule and try to get into the tent inner while I'm actually in it myself, and even after punching them through the tent wall (not to hard - don't want to damage the tent), they keep coming back.

I've also heard the currawongs can open pack zips too, but I've not seen this myself.

I think the best thing you can do is to package your food such that it minimises how much smell can get out, to do you washing up well away from the camp site, and to keep food secure in your pack when your not at your camp site

[frank_in_oz]

I agree that possums are more of a problem than rats (at least in my experience). They are capable of causing serious damage to tents, and can get into packs. They'll sometimes come right into the tent vestibule and try to get into the tent inner while I'm actually in it myself, and even after punching them through the tent wall (not to hard - don't want to damage the tent), they keep coming back.

Agree Nik. met a guy several years ago who had borrowed his Dad's brand new tent. At Windemere he woke up with a possum on his chest eating a Mars bar. He started to "reeducate it" with a Mag light and ended up trashing the tent as it tried to create new openings with it's claws as it tried to escape (not to mention the hole it created to get in there! ) I was there when his old man picked him up (for protection I think) and he was, shall we say, rather cross.

I've also heard the currawongs can open pack zips too, but I've not seen this myself.

Have seen this too, they are smart birds. Was told by a volunteer at Waterfall valley once to just put on your pack cover.. If they can't SEE the zip they don't think it is there.....

I think the best thing you can do is to package your food such that it minimises how much smell can get out, to do you washing up well away from the camp site, and to keep food secure in your pack when your not at your camp site

In addition, on the OT we ALWAYS put our pack in the hut and make sure we have NO food in the tent. Never had problems with possums at night (still hear em , at least I THINK it was possums)

On Hinckinbrook Island last year, native rats were the issue and we hung our packs on ropes each night between 2 trees and carried empty Coke bottles we threaded length ways on the rope. The rats could walk the rope but not get over the Coke bottle!! There is a shadowy pic here - http://frankinoz.blogspot.com/2007/09/t ... sland.html

[Pompom]

I think that the most likely rat type found on the track is the Velvet Furred Rat, he's a joy to watch and harmless.I remember my mother coming to stay with us at Derwent Bridge and one [semi pet] ran across the hearth, she told dad that we were overrun with rats especially as she also saw a potoroo do the same thing a few minutes later.I don't reckon they would be much of a problem in the park proper as the snakes would likely keep them down around the huts.
I found a possum with a tin can stuck over its head,[been there all night] and this proved to be the hairiest operation I've ever performed with tin snips. I also found a dead one in a garbage can apparently it had died from the gas that had escaped from a discarded camping gas cylinder,the gas lying on the bottom of the can, best to crush them.
Sorry to distort the thread but I thought someone might be interested.

[sthughes]

Never had a major Rat issue in a National Park, but haven't done the OT either.

Camping at the southern end of Wineglass Bay a few years back we had a little Possum problem. Appharently they like Continental Cuppa Soup. We had an unopened box of the little foil sachets in a tied up supermarket bag, in a pack with the top drawstring done up and the 'lid' clipped down sitting about 500mm from our heads in the vestibule through nothing but flyscreen. At about 2-3am we awoke to hear a Possum scratching around, thought nothing of it at first cause we were sure there was nothing they could get. We still did the tent bashing thing to scare it off - but this didnt work. So gave him a whack through the fly screen, little bugger just kept on going, gave him a proper punch (yeah as hard as I could short of going through the fly screen). That got rid of him, well for about 30 seconds anyway. When he came back it was time to open the screen and show him who's boss. It obviously knew the sound of a zip meant he bedda get the hell out of there cause he was gone before i had it open. It was only then that we realised why he'd been so reluctant to go - because he was busy chomping through his second satchel of cuppa soup! Had opened the pack lid clips, forced the drawstig open, got around the trangia, tore open the box and then opened the satchels (so humans struggle to open them but I guess Possums have no worries). Interestingly it didn't even touch the nutrigrain, biscuts, cheese or cabanna that were all easyer to get at!!

Giant Water rat things are also very persistant at the Treasure Island caravan park in Hobart (Just off the Brooker). Try not to get a tent site on the edge of the river!

[frank_in_oz]

I know this is off the topic of rats and heading towards bushwalking pests but thought I would throw this in anyway.

Wilsons prom in Victoria is another great place for pesky possums. Camping at Sealers Cove one night and there were about 10 VORACIOUS possums around the site. Mate was under a hutchie and at one stage there were 4 around him searching for food.

I had a LARGE block of "Old Gold" chocolate taken from in my pack (just next to my head in the vesibule) and when I finally got up to chase the possum away it was sitting on a log 2 metres away with the block grasped in its little "hands" chewing away like crazy. Once it had finished that it (or it's mates) returned and attacked the pack again. Not much sleep was had that night......

[The Lone Spectator]

For the benefit of Ranger Jen Calder

An Ode to the Narcissus Hut Swamp Antechinus

Like parlour whores
They primp and preen
behind closed doors
in crevices unseen

Daily they await their fate
their nightly desires hoping to sate
with insects, scroggin morsels or crumbs of cake

Amid the stillness of the Narcissus Hut
with weary walkers asleep and eyes tightly shut
they seemlessly emerge from their backroom verge
with ambitious appetites keen to purge

Athletically they scurry about
through pack,bag and box
unerringly scratching their way through boots and sox
and then as night melds into day
they deposit their little excretia and scuttle away
to ready themselves for yet another foray.

Peter Harley was at Pine Valley and Narcissus Huts in late March 2010

[Erica]

Nice Poem!
Did you want me to pass that on to Jen for you?/does Jen read this? If so, HI JEN!
Haven't had a problem with rats etc on the OLT, make sure you don't leave things outside for possums to eat them...

[The Lone Spectator]

She may or may not read this, so pass it on to her if possible. She is fond of communicating by verse, as messages in a number of huts attest.