AARN packs

[ninjapuppet]

I have since decided to ditch the water bladders in favour of 4 x 1.5L Nalgene bottles

Where can you get these 1.5L nalgenes? I didnt knew they existed till you mentioned

[wazzawalkin]

I have got them from,

http://stores.shop.ebay.com.au/The-Wright-Stuff-Outdoor-Gear

Cheers
W.

[Tony]

Again with respect your comments are based on hearsay and supposition,what we need on this Forum is factual comments based on actual use and experience of gear please.
corvus

Great comment, I could not agree with you more Corvus.

As you would be aware when I post about lightweight gear I get a lot of negative comments about the gear by people who have never even seen the gear, though gone out and used it. I could bring up lots of examples if you want.

I do value you your and all opinions about all gear on Bushwalk.com forum.

Tony

[corvus]

Again with respect your comments are based on hearsay and supposition,what we need on this Forum is factual comments based on actual use and experience of gear please.
corvus

Great comment, I could not agree with you more Corvus.

As you would be aware when I post about lightweight gear I get a lot of negative comments about the gear by people who have never even seen the gear, though gone out and used it. I could bring up lots of examples if you want.

I do value you your and all opinions about all gear on Bushwalk.com forum.

Tony

Just finished seam sealing a Tarp Tent (Scarp 1) which is really lightweight for 4 season use in Tassie, who would have thought that I (considering my comments a couple of years ago) would have contemplated a Tarp(albeit 2 skin ) tent.
Just shows you are never too old to learn and that you can learn lots on this forum however I am still a canvas pack and full leather boots Man

corvus

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[Tony]

Hi Corvus,

Just finished seam sealing a Tarp Tent (Scarp 1) which is really lightweight for 4 season use in Tassie, who would have thought that I (considering my comments a couple of years ago) would have contemplated a Tarp(albeit 2 skin ) tent.
Just shows you are never too old to learn and that you can learn lots on this forum however I am still a canvas pack and full leather boots Man

corvus

Great to see you moving toward the light side.

I look forward to seeing your review of the Scarp1.

If I walked a lot in Tasmania my gear would probably be different and I probably would use thick leather boots for some walks as I do sometimes do in the Australian Alps.

Tony

[Tony]

Hi Brett,

Hi Tony

For me the problem is the Ultra Light term and how it is defined rather than the concept itself. The Aarn pack is light weight and innovative in harness design but not UL, at least by some standards. Also UL can with say Wilderness Equipment mean the lightest tent in their range even though there are much lighter two skinned tents in other brands. Terms are horrible things to define with my favourite been the MSR Simmer-lite, as it neither light weight nor simmers I have looked at a distance at the Aarn pack and more closely at TR's pack and thought bush bashing might show the downside. In fact mesh on any pack is a potential weak point when heading through scrub.

I suppose the issue I have with UL is the same as F1. Does it mean extreme weight saving at the cost of all other aspects like a F1 car means extreme performance at the cost to anything else or is it more logical weight saving, say lighter weight? If UL means extreme weight saving then fair enough but that then means there is likely greater tolerance by the adherents to failure and also a shorter life expectancy for gear. With UL by definition you are constantly chasing the lightest weight so a ten to twenty year pack life is not such a concern. Or that is at least how I see it.

Anyway I am watching this thread for more reports on the heavy duty versions of the Aarn packs along with where they are made. Still at this stage I would be reluctant to leave behind my One Planet McMillian but get the feeling I am slowly falling for the OP Stiletto, hey it is a kilogram lighter Though an Aarn for the long track walks is tempting if I could just come to terms with all those straps

Cheers Brett

I have read a lot of debates as to the definition weights on UL and LW and not even the experts can come to a consensus as to the cutoff weights but one thing is for sure the Australian gear designers and importers seem to have there own rules as to what they call LW, it is only through forums like this that we can have any hope of educating the the general walking community as to what LW and UL mean.

My UL Golite Jam2 pack took some minor damage the first time I used it, I was doing a day walk in the Namadgi Park in southern ACT, it was in steep granite boulder country where we did lots of scrambling up, down and in some cases through the granite rocks, the granite was very abrasive as granite can be and one side pocket of the Jam2 got a bit damage, the body of the pack which is made from UL Dyneema showed no sign of damage and two years and may tough walks later though a bit dirty is still in good condition and the side pocket is still ok, I am not expecting 20 years though it looks like I will get 5+ not bad for A$102

Aarn packs are a very good design, the distribution of load front and back is the most efficient way of backpacking a load as it attempts to put the load over your natural center of gravity, Aarn packs do not completely do this but are a step in the right direction, having your load distributed evenly over your center of gravity uses the least energy. There is some evidence that having front packs can inhibit breathing more than just backpacks, by putting the packs on the outside at the front the Aarn pack design does minimize this and all backpacks inhibit breathing to some extent, front packs can also limit vision in front of body, and can induce more heat stress when compared to the backpack.

Tony

[Taurë-rana]

If UL means extreme weight saving then fair enough but that then means there is likely greater tolerance by the adherents to failure and also a shorter life expectancy for gear.

But that may be better than a shorter (bushwalking) life expectancy of the adherents

There is some evidence that having front packs can inhibit breathing more than just backpacks, by putting the packs on the outside at the front the Aarn pack design does minimize this and all backpacks inhibit breathing to some extent, front packs can also limit vision in front of body, and can induce more heat stress when compared to the backpack.

Can't comment on the heat stress, anything that warmed me up last walk was a good thing! I don't find the Aarn's front pockets limit vision significantly, but they do make it harder to bend down and tie shoelaces etc. I can imagine that this wouldn't be nearly such a problem for taller people.

[Andrew]

I love my Aarn Natural Balance. Have carried 7 days of gear no issues. Just got back from 4 day trip yesterday.

The Natural Balance has 2 dry bags which is fantastic to be able to put wet tent and coat in bottom and then put rest of gear in top without plastic bags or pack covers. Keep stove, lunch, water, heavier item in balance pockets. No issues at all with balance pockets it is great to walk upright and doesn't limit vision or make me hot etc.

Seems sturdy and is so light at 2059g for what you get with no liners etc. needed. I started with 13kg this 4 day trip and it feels like nothing with this great pack.

Bought a Featherlite Freedom for my wife too but haven't used that much yet. Featherlite Freedom is 1711g.

Bought an Aarn Pacer 2 tent on the strength of the great pack design and happy with that too but not as over the moon as with the Natural Balance.

Cheers,

Andrew

[ninjapuppet]

Andrew, theres not much info online about those Pacer tents.

can you give us a review with pictures, when you get a chance?

[earthglider]

I have since ditched the 1.5Litre Nalgene bottles, as x 4 of them weigh about 600grams even without any water in them. Back to my MSR Hydromedry bladders (half the weight, including sipper hoses), but the bigger pockets in the 2010 Natural balance has made this an easy choice. I did however order x 8 of the 1.5Litre wide-mouth flexible Nalgene Canteens from Wrightstuff, which should arrive next week. Don't know if i'll need them now, but they seemed like a good idea at the time!

[earthglider]

Got the 2010 Natural Balance two weeks ago, and it is brilliant.

The evolution from the 2008 Natural Balance is immediatley noticeable and the userfriendliness, ease of use and increased fit has created a pack which is a pleasure to use.

The double hip-belt adjustments took a little to get used to, but after 15 minutes on the trail, the more refined adjustment allowed me to create a much more precise fit and relieved pressure points on the hips.

The more stable balance pockets prevented swinging for side to side the increased size was a good bonus. The external mesh on the pockets kept maps, headlamps, fire-lighter, pocket knife and handy other items secure close at hand which was a nice touch, although I was somewhat perplexed as to why each mesh pocket were asymetrical? No problem of course, and if anything, it was a reminder how much increased handiness the additional mesh pockets were!

The spars on the pockets seemed a lot more secure, although they did tend to dig into my belly and groin somewhat if the top of the pockets weren't held very close to my chest.

There is still some slight twisting forward of the hip-belt buckle and balance pocket spars which i found dug into my pelvis and groin when the pockets had about 3-4kg in each side. I attempted to adjust the tension on the buckle and to cushion the buckle and pocket-spars with a folded tee-shirt, which alleviated the pressure somewhat, although i found the pain only went away when i was wearing thick thermals and and rain-jackect the following day which may have provided more cushioning or less chaffing of the hip buckle and spars?

Overall, the Aarn Natural Balance 2010 is my most favourite, and most reliable piece of kit. I keep it next to my bedroom door and every time i see it i am inspired to get out on the trails once again!!

There has been some debate over whether the Natural Balance is UL or just light. I see on other forums some people who swear by 700gram Golite packs, some which don't even have any hipbelts. I personally find the Natural Balance more comfortable carrying a 16kg load than i find most daypacks carrying only 6kg. No strain on the shoulders or back, no awkward feeling like there's a koala or wombat clinging to my shoulders. The balance pockets really do change the centre of gravity, and since i've ditched my Thermarest Z-lite mat which i used to strap to the back of the pack, the sence of balance has increased.

I figure i would rather lose 1.5kg of bodyfat (from my admittably large 100kg frame) then deal with aching shoulders and aching back caused by flimsy 'UL' back-packs.

On the Tarptents, i am leaning towards the Scarp 1 myself. Tried the 2010 Rainbow on the weekend and it was FREEZING. With the extra liner, the Rainbow is about the same weight as the Scarp 1, but much less versatile. The Scarp 1 seems like a much more sensible option in cold weather, especially with drip-free entry. If i kept the Rainbow, i would be so cold I would need to increase the weight of my sleeping bag anyway, which would negate any weight offsets with a lighter tent.

[Ent]

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[earthglider]

Aarn replied quickly to the issues i was having with the Natural Balance and i will try his suggestions shortly. Aarn believes I need to adjust the bend at the bottom of the Balance Pocket frame to get the holster to sit flat against the tummy. I will try out and report back shortly.

[Franco]

Earthglider
I don't want to hijack the thread cause I love my Aarn... but wanted to clarify the bit about the TT
The Scarps are the only TT's meant to work "4 season" . The Rainbow (and most others) are used, particularly in the US , by some in winter simply because they can..
Usually they wear some if not all of their camp clothing inside their sleeping bag (or quilt...)
Their way of thinking is that they can use the 500g puffy jacket at camp anyway but don't have to carry an extra 500/1000 g for a double wall tent all day.
Often the reason you see pics of one of them in the snow is because it is either at the start or the end of the hiking season. Thruhikers can start in March/April and finish in Sept/Oct.
Yesterday I spotted this comment at BPL :

"Interestingly enough, I found that there are not many tarp users thru-hiking the PCT (this) year. Most folks set up a tent each night. There are quite a few single-wall tents on the trail and Tarptents seem to be the most common."

The Pacific Crest Trail is from the Mexican to the Canadian border, 4260 Km.

Franco

[north-north-west]

I just bought an Aarn Natural Exhilaration daypack. Only had a couple of short walks with it so far, but the difference to my older daypacks is enormous - no more stiff neck, no grating shoulder bones, no aching hip. Have to get a Load Limo or Natural Balance for my overnighters, once I can afford it.

[Jazzlover]

Over the last few months I have read with interest the comments posted about Aarn packs as I contemplated upgrading from my Macpac Canyon. I subsequently bought a Load Limo and have just completed an off-track 7 day hike in Kakadu. I carried about 12kg on the back and about 4kg in the pockets. Despite 30+C days, the pockets did not have any noticeable affect on my body heat. Ventilation was excellent as they hung quite freely away from the body. However, there are some negatives. When going through the motions of swinging the pack on, the swinging pockets can be a bit of a nuisance. The more weight in them, the bigger the nuisance. But when the waist belt is buckled, the pockets sit very comfortably. The only time I found them a real problem was when I had to do some serious cliff hugging. You need to be very aware of the space they take on your chest. But they do not impede your vision. There was a great deal of rock hopping and scrambling on my hike and the pockets were not an issue. The real benefit for me was no more sore shoulders. No more headaches from a stiff neck. When I hiked with the old Macpac, I was always eager to get it off my back when we had a break. With the Aarn, it was very comfortable to just rest with the pack on. The pack's capacity is excellent and the fabric did not succumb to thorns, burnt woodland or sandstone grazing. I am looking forward to my next hike.

[ninjapuppet]

Nice pack review mate.

I wouldnt mind some 30+C here at the moment in sydney.

[earthglider]

Earthglider
I don't want to hijack the thread cause I love my Aarn... but wanted to clarify the bit about the TT
The Scarps are the only TT's meant to work "4 season" . The Rainbow (and most others) are used, particularly in the US , by some in winter simply because they can..

Franco

Thanks Franco. Noted. Got the Scarp 2010. It's done the trick. Warm as toast.

[north-north-west]

That really should be a blissfully happy smile, but the forum's range of emoticons is severely limited.

Two weeks ago I bought a Load Limo. Had one short walk down the Prom, which confirmed my initial fears that the hipbelt was too big, so Tim fitted a smaller one last Friday and I spent Saturday walking from Jimmy's Creek to Wannon and back, with everything I'd take for an overnighter except food, just to see what it's like. 26km in nice sunny weather with plenty of wedgies and orchids and hardly any people.

I'm in love. It has to be the best pack/harness design around. Not perfect, but probably as close as you can get.

The negatives:
I'm a shortarse, so it's the smaller pack (for the shorter harness), which means reduced capacity.
The Expedition pockets are too big for me so, again, smaller Sport pockets means even less volume.
A bit awkward putting on intact and loaded if you don't have either someone to lift it or something to rest it on. (But it only takes a minute to reattach the pockets, so one can always put it on in two stages, which will probably be my usual method.)
Not hydration pack ready. Biggest problem for me, but one can strap the bladder on or shove it under the flap.

There's a little bit of steeper stuff on that track, but the pockets weren't a problem on the scrambles. Cliff-hugging they may be, although it wouldn't be hard to clip or strap them onto the back or sides of the pack for such situations. Have to find some challenging rocks to give it more of a test.

[s_gledhill]

north-north-west,

I bought 1 from Tim back in June and have only had time to use it a couple times. I haven't got the loading and adjustment quite right yet, and I'm starting to think that I also need to go down a belt size - but the lack of strain on my back it's been worth every cent. With the belt I ordered according to waist measurement but find I've got almost no adjustment when it's appropriately tight. Yes, you're right - I have to talk to Tim...!

Simon

[north-north-west]

Just take it back in on a Thursday or Friday evening (when you can be fairly sure of catching him there). It only took them ten minutes to swap the belt and adjust the support.
Just enough time for me to try on a pair of pants . . .

[melinda]

I have been using a Marathon Magic as my day pack for about 3 years know.
The picture below is of the newer model. (Still very similar to the older model.)
This pack has been great and will happily replace it with a new one when the old one wears out.

[Franco]

"A bit awkward putting on intact and loaded if you don't have either someone to lift it or something to rest it on. "

The trick is to create a seat by putting your left leg forward and bending that knee. You then lift the pack over to that knee, put your right arm through the shoulder strap and from that to your shoulders.
If you are already doing this, the above may then help someone else.
Franco

[north-north-west]

An old diving trick that one, Franco. I've also tried doing the over the head thing as I do with a single scuba tank, but the pockets do make it a little more awkward. Besides, it's a bit wide to do that comfortably.
But so far I've managed to find a rock or fallen tree to help when necessary.

[Lizzy]

Still love my Aarn- just makes hiking so much more comfortable I don't seem to have any problem getting the pack on thankfully but this last trip to Tassie I did notice I got snagged a few times and a plastic strap snapped... not entirely sure what this strap was for and haven't noticed any negaitve effect yet.... thought it was the one that comes across the waist for the 'flow-mo' straps but fortunately that one was still intact. Will be interesting to see long term durability... before this I used a macpac canyon which was pretty bombproof but also gave me sore shoulders/back so I'll be staying with the Aarn thats for sure!
Lizzy

[gbedford]

I have an Aarn Guiding Light.

Modified it. Made the lid pocket bigger. Cut off the straps and shovel pocket at the fron and added a pocket. Removed the rope zip at the top.

Nice pack but the jury is still out with the sliding shoulder straps.
They certainly don't work when ski touring as they accentuate any weight shift. Not the best thing to happen when one is skiing.
Not sure that they do much with normal walking except make getting it on a little more difficult.

I still find it comfortable though.

Cheers,
Gordon

[Franco]

Found this You Tube clip at an American forum today
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfafuFbY ... r_embedded
shows how to turn the pockets into a day pack.
funny thing is that I know the lady demonstrating it (from Backpackinglight in Melbourne) but had no idea they shot that.
Franco

[ninjapuppet]

Just came across this: http://www.departmentofgoods.com/wright-mcgill-co.-madison-pod-pack

and to get 50% off RRP, you can use this code here: 5YL-1-MEFCU.

whats really funny is that its colours mimick my Aarn pack with its grey and gold colour too.

[north-north-west]

Found this You Tube clip at an American forum today
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfafuFbY ... r_embedded
shows how to turn the pockets into a day pack.
funny thing is that I know the lady demonstrating it (from Backpackinglight in Melbourne) but had no idea they shot that.
Franco

Yeah, Tim showed me how that works. Extra straps are standard with the Load Limo, too.