Aarn input and experiences please

[Mark F]

Well done Ms Mudd. So often I see people in all areas of life persevere with solutions that don't really work for them. The Aarn system works for those carrying quite heavy loads so if it isn't working for you one solution, and certainly not the only one, is lighten the load. I worked for me and based on your posts I think you are well aware of the possibilities to lighten up (load wise not your personality )

[Ms_Mudd]

Puzzled. Have never known a hip belt to have metal.

It is odd- totally agree! It is maybe 20mm wide and runs the entire vertical width of each side of the hip belt right under where the metal tip of the balance pocket stays slots in. I understand the theory of load transfer, but clearly the reality does not work in my case.

Well done Ms Mudd. So often I see people in all areas of life persevere with solutions that don't really work for them. The Aarn system works for those carrying quite heavy loads so if it isn't working for you one solution, and certainly not the only one, is lighten the load. I worked for me and based on your posts I think you are well aware of the possibilities to lighten up (load wise not your personality )

Thanks MarkF- thanks for the reply, bit chuffed really that you noticed. I am a bit proud I have flown the white flag on this one, feel happy to move forward with something that fits my needs better- I am usually quite stubborn in most respects so don't like to give in.
Yes, much like you, I have had cause to reconsider my load and where I can cut some grams/bulk. I am lightosh, but could be certainly lighter. My first aid kit springs to mind first up. Working in health as I do, it is a veritable pharmacy and mobile wound clinic. My husband calls me 'Walter White' who I think was the teacher turned drug dealer in a TV series he watched?
Honestly, lightening up my personality as well as my packweight right now would be good too Day of 'uni work' - or pack research ha- and then an insanely busy 10.5 hours of night duty. Not feeling flash at all.

[FionaShedden]

Been watching with interest as I was just about to buy an AARN to replace my 20 YO massive Gregory pack that at over 3kg's now seems a bit heavy. I have a small lightweight for weekend trips, but was thinking a new mid sized would be great for when I do hikes with my Scouts and I carry a bit more gear as a back-up/in case of emergency. I do love my Gregory though - it has the best fit on me and the massive padding on the waist strap is so comfortable! Still in pretty good condition too given all the scrub bashing I have done in it! Just concerned as I get older about weight as I definitely find it is harder to go the distance these days.

Have been gradually replacing stuff with lightweight version, but the pack is still the big one left.

I am a bit worried about how complicated the AARN packs seem and your experiences are now scaring me off a little. It's a big investment that I don't want to go wrong!

HMM now very indecisive!

[peregrinator]

Fiona, I'm a very pleased Aarn user (no affiliation with the company). One ingredient that might prove crucial is the ability to visit a store to inspect the product and get personal attention from an informed salesperson. Ms_Mudd had plenty of great attention and advice, but perhaps may never had purchased a Aarn product had she been able to get to a store. For one thing, she would have been able to clearly see that there is nothing particularly complicated about the design and the fitting. I know it can seem otherwise if you've followed Ms_Mudd's saga. I had considerable trepidation too before I went to a store and learnt how the thing works. It's no more complicated than an orthodox design, in my opinion, other than taking no more than one minute longer to put on.

[peregrinator]

Looks like the OP Canopy is a renaming of their Overshadow, which is what I use. It's certainly a great pack for my needs, but of course everybody's body is different and has different fits/issues. I've had no experience with Aarn Packs, so can't compare. However, with my loads being significantly lighter than they used to be, I'm not as interested in the balance option as I might have been several years ago. (And I'm not even a light-weight walker.)

Slightly unrelated rant...

Still blows my mind that One Planet seem to be the only back packs in the known universe that actually have bottle-shaped pockets*. Most other packs have flat pockets that are very difficult to cram bottles into when the pack is full, or pockets that are too short to fit a 1 litre bottle fully into, or are wider at the top than at the bottom meaning bottles are more likely to get squeezed or wobbled out. Perhaps the other brands' pockets are not actually designed for bottles, but that's what many people use them for. Just look at the ULA Circuit pockets loaded with bottles in their own promotional pictures at https://www.ula-equipment.com/product/circuit/ (see the second and third picture). The bottles look like they're about to fall out even without moving the pack.

With One Planet "hydration pockets", I can stow and extract my water bottles while walking without taking the pack off or asking somebody else for help, and without worring about them falling out**. This seems like a fairly simple thing, but I don't see people with other packs able to do this.

Maybe I'm in the minority in still preferring bottles, and most other people have moved on to bladders.

* I fully expect (and hope!) some replies to point out how wrong I am and that there are actually proper bottle pockets on other brands.

** There is potential for bottles to fall out of OP pockets while scrub bashing or while stowing the pack upside down in a pack raft. In these two cases, I use small carabiner type clips to hold them in and can still stow/retrieve them by myself with pack on.

I am interested in your comments (and the reply from Ms_Mudd) on water bottles. I don’t believe It is an unrelated rant, slightly or otherwise. Many of us carry water bottles and/or bladders and want easy access to them but not the hassles you mention.

As an Aarn user, I’ve found that the ability to comfortably carry quantities of water is the greatest feature of the Aarn backpack and pockets combination.

Let's say I have up to six litres depending on the trip. All of that, and any subsequent replenishment along the way can sit in the pockets. (There will still be room for other things.) The water doesn't go in the outer mesh stretchy things, but in the pockets proper where they are in no danger of falling out. The mesh is useful only for small, less bulky things. The heavy component of one's load represented by water balances the weight of the backpack’s contents. As water is consumed, empty containers are replaced in the pockets by small weightier items from the pack, such as fuel.

[Lamont]

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[Ms_Mudd]

Ms_Mudd had plenty of great attention and advice, but perhaps may never had purchased a Aarn product had she been able to get to a store. For one thing, she would have been able to clearly see that there is nothing particularly complicated about the design and the fitting. I know it can seem otherwise if you've followed Ms_Mudd's saga. I had considerable trepidation too before I went to a store and learnt how the thing works. It's no more complicated than an orthodox design, in my opinion, other than taking no more than one minute longer to put on.

I would have still bought it in store I think. The issues from the metal stay only appeared after each use, as soft tissue injuries do. Would have been no way to forsee that as for all intents and purposes it felt fine on.

You are right, they are not too complex to fit. My saga with fit was trying to troubleshoot a problem that really couldn't be remedied in my case. I was mistakenly thinking the cause was in the fit- it wasnt.

Once the issue was diagnosed, it was a lightbulb moment. Simple problem. No amount of adjustment or head scratching that preceeded it would change that for me. So disregard my ponderings on the thread, and jump to the end- metal stays on bony hips aint the best

[slparker]

Damn...

In a drunken impulse the other night I pulled the trigger on a Mountain Magic 42... and I was so proud of only having two packs to my name.

When its possible to go overnight camping again I'll report on pack... I hope I don't get the same issue as MM!

[Ms_Mudd]

How exciting Slpacker!!!Maybe your online shopping carts should have a breathalyser attached to them? Congrats on your new pack.
Bet it will be awesome and you will love it. Look forward to hearing of your first adventure.

[stry]

It's an ill wind that blows no good, MsMudd.

I have flirted with the idea of buying an Aarn for many years, and looked at them at BPL several times, but there was something that didn't quite click for me. Your Aarn journey may have identified that "something".

Obvious gender differences aside, it appears from your posts that we share physical similarities. IE although I am scrawny, my hips are broad in relation to my build, and those hips have very little meat on them, especially at the front.

The flame within me to experiment has been been extinguished, and I'll stick with my OPs.

Thank you.

[Ms_Mudd]

It's an ill wind that blows no good, MsMudd.
The flame within me to experiment has been been extinguished, and I'll stick with my OPs.
Thank you.

Just call me crusher of dreams, extinguisher of flames It does indeed sound as if we have similar physiques, glad my trial and error was useful for your wallet.

I am interested in your comments (and the reply from Ms_Mudd) on water bottles. I don’t believe It is an unrelated rant, slightly or otherwise. Many of us carry water bottles and/or bladders and want easy access to them but not the hassles you mention.

As an Aarn user, I’ve found that the ability to comfortably carry quantities of water is the greatest feature of the Aarn backpack and pockets combination.

Let's say I have up to six litres depending on the trip. All of that, and any subsequent replenishment along the way can sit in the pockets. (There will still be room for other things.) The water doesn't go in the outer mesh stretchy things, but in the pockets proper where they are in no danger of falling out. The mesh is useful only for small, less bulky things. The heavy component of one's load represented by water balances the weight of the backpack’s contents. As water is consumed, empty containers are replaced in the pockets by small weightier items from the pack, such as fuel.

With the Aarn I ended up putting a soft flask, like my Osprey Hydraulics or Salomon, with a long mouthpiece valve inside the balance pocket itself with the extended mouth of the flask poking out the zip for the most part.It was very convenient as it is the same idea I use with my running vest, I could just tip my head forward slightly and drink easily. The only thing I didn't love about that idea though as once consumed, there would be a minus 500-1000g on that side until refilled or something else moved into that balance pocket to make up the weight. When trail running with the flasks up front system, I just make sure to drink evenly from each side,so as not to unbalance the vest, but the forward weight in that scenario is not an important part of the system like it is with the Aarn.

Not sure what my water system will be going forward from the Aarn and my soft flasks, I did enjoy the accessibility it offered. I have moved away from hydration bladders after using one for the last 2-3 years following an unfortunate unplanned aquatic event in my pack when I hadn't clipped all the components of my hydration system together properly. A pack with usable water bottle pockets could be something that works,provided it can be accessed without needing to dislocate a shoulder. I am yet to use a pack where I can easily reach and re- stow bottles on the side independently.

[matagi]

I've been off doing the 3 capes track so just caught up on this thread. I agree the complexity of the harness system is one of the annoying things about an Aarn pack, but once you get it right, they are great. Also, both my husband and I have found things slip and you need to be constantly tightening particularly the hip belt. I carried 12kg on this trip and had to regulalry tighten the hip belt.

From the photos you posted, I agree with others the hip belt is sitting too high. Just checked my own hip belt and the bit of metal on my belt is about 5mm wide and approximately 30mm long and sits where the balance pockets attach. I can see a design flaw here in that the bottom of that piece is not quite down far enough to be covered by padding, but you need to bend the belt a fair way to get it to stick out and stab you. Also, if the pack is rubbing on your shoulders, the back length is too short or the weight is not sitting on your hips correctly.

How far have you adjusted the tilt on the hip belt?

Also, there is this adjustment (photo attached) that seems to pull in the bottom of the pack to the hip belt, maybe also try adjusting that? It's too bad you don't live in Tassie, otherwise we could come and visit and see if we could help.

Maybe give it one last shot before you abandon the Aarn for good.

[north-north-west]

Those belts are very different to the ones on my Load Limos. Wonder why they put that metal bit in?

[Moondog55]

https://www.aarnpacks.com/pages/aarn-pack-fitting

Note whether the thin area behind the holster bar 21 is over the front point of your hipbone. If the stretch panel or the gap 21 is forward of the front edge of your hipbone, the hipbelt needs shortening; if it is behind, the hipbelt needs lengthening. Notice by how much. To adjust the hipbelt, you must separate the hipbelt from its framesheet. To access, release the bottom corners of the mesh backpanel 22 by undoing the velcro tabs. Now, separate each hipbelt end from the framesheet.
*To shorten the hipbelt, reposition the hipbelt further in (keeping the framesheet and hipbelt velcro in line).
*To lengthen the hipbelt, reposition the hipbelt further out (keep the framesheet and hipbelt velcro in line).

I've had a good read through the Aarn website and I am confused by the metal bit on the hip belt as the only metal bits I can see are the press studs on each side that stop the pocket wires from jumping out of the small socket.
Are you talking about the wire stay that suppors the pockets by any chance?
When lockdown is over I really must head up to Melbourne and check one out in person

[north-north-west]

I've had a good read through the Aarn website and I am confused by the metal bit on the hip belt as the only metal bits I can see are the press studs on each side that stop the pocket wires from jumping out of the small socket.

Those press studs are the only metal bits on my belts. The pockets have the long diagonal metal bars, but as the holsters they slide into sit at the front of the belt, there shouldn't be any rubbing from them. It's all very confusing.

[Ms_Mudd]

Oh really? Perhaps that is his old style, maybe the metal stay in the hip belt is a newer thing. I have the metal press stud sleeve on my hip belt too, then an additional metal strip within the hip belt that runs directly under it for the full length of the hip belt. Will take a pic and see if I can show you what I mean.

[Ms_Mudd]

The pack is down from the shed again (no goats harmed in its extraction) as it is listed on Gumtree etc, so just snapped some pics.

So I was incorrect in saying the metal stay runs the whole vertical length of the hipbelt, it is more like 2/3. My apologies for not being great at describing the issue, clear as Mudd eh? Hopefully pics may help. I even got fancy and circled bits, so tech savvy of me, although my 12yo did just help me

1. First pic is so you can see location of the press stud hip belt sleeve where the balance pocket stays go, marked with an arrow.
2. Second pic is metal stay, encased in the webbing, circled in red.
3. Third pic is from the underside, with my fingers either side of the metal stay.

If the hip belt metal stay is a new addition (my pack is the most recent version of the Peak Aspiration) , it isn't a good bit of new innovation. If older hipbelts don't have it, may explain why there are so very many happy Aarn users out there, as the whole system would work ever so much better without a strip of metal on the piece of harness that is doing the most work.
The fact that Aarn was aware of the hipbelt issues with slender hipped people and members of a previous posters bush walking club having the same issue, perhaps we are just owners of newer packs? Or if not and the older hip belts do indeed have the stay, the very few who have had similar problems may be just be all of very similar body type as everyone else seems to find the system very comfortable.

[Ms_Mudd]

Also, if the pack is rubbing on your shoulders, the back length is too short or the weight is not sitting on your hips correctly.


Maybe give it one last shot before you abandon the Aarn for good.

Totally correct there Matagi- the shoulder rub was 100% caused by me rather than the pack itself. I shortened the back length and hoisted up hip the hip belt even higher as you can see in pics. I just could not stand another step with the hip belt on my hips,so did the 'field' McGyvering to alleviate that pain, in turn causing the shoulder rub issue, I was aware of the friction on my clavicles at the time, but it was the lesser of two evils.

I am pretty done with the pack to be honest, but it is so kind of you (and other Forum posters also) to be so supportive and helpful, I genuinely appreciate it. I am lucky to be part of such a community of fine people.
The hip belt just is not for me, such a deal breaker. I also probably don't carry enough weight frequently to make the set up particularly beneficial either, but at least my Aarn curiosity was sated after two visits to Little Bourke Street last year and wondering about them. I guess much like trail runners, what one finds comfortable, another may not. My daughters Osprey Renn 50lt will suffice for now, I have walked with it twice before and have no beef with the fit- we even have the same torso length fitting. As for our planned trip next week, I can still use her pack and she can just carry my 40ish lt Lowe Alpine pack as she doesn't carry much more than her clothes and sleeping gear anyway.

[Warin]

Water bottles.
Some of the osprey packs have a side entry for the side pockets (as well as the top entry. I have put a water bottle there and it works, unless you bend to almost horizontal and the bottle may fall out - not had it happen myself but something I an cautious with.

There are fittings to put a water bottle on the front straps. The zpacks bottle neck clip one looks to be the best to me - easy to use.. but limited to less than 1 litre.

[slparker]

How exciting Slpacker!!!Maybe your online shopping carts should have a breathalyser attached to them? Congrats on your new pack.
Bet it will be awesome and you will love it. Look forward to hearing of your first adventure.

My drunken purchase arrived today... no adventures for a while as we are in stage 3 lockdown. Bright side? I have a few weeks to get to grips with the straps buckles, straps and, er, straps.

[Ms_Mudd]

How exciting Slpacker!!!Maybe your online shopping carts should have a breathalyser attached to them? Congrats on your new pack.
Bet it will be awesome and you will love it. Look forward to hearing of your first adventure.

My drunken purchase arrived today... no adventures for a while as we are in stage 3 lockdown. Bright side? I have a few weeks to get to grips with the straps buckles, straps and, er, straps.

There are far worse things you could do while drunk than receiving a parcel in the mail No trips to the Dr's to find out what the rash is at least

Hope lock down gives you some time to work it out and have a few cracks at loading it up about the house.

[Ms_Mudd]

Winner,winner.
Had a new pack for a week and a half. Few tweaks after getting correct sized hipbelt swapped out, mainly re: shoulder straps.
Been wearing it loaded around house, but properly packed it out yesterdayfor a walk in next few days and just walked 7km with a friend in undulating country.

Stoked.

One Planet Canopy with added on hip belt pockets.

Packed out with everything except food but carrying my largest pot,3p tent, 2 Lt water,even the kids frisbee etc so was at 10.4kg.

Hurrrahhhhbh

[Lamont]

Stop teasing.How about a couple of phone pictures of the winner all packed up? If it's not still loaded could you put some pillows in to show the shape. Dying to see it!

[Ms_Mudd]

She is still loaded, all ready for adventures in coming days.
Just stopped at roadworks, will do a photo shoot when home. Only got one selfie of happiness when out with her.

Edited as home now, shall add pics. The close up of the shoulder straps is to show the angle I had to attach them at to fit my female form, just so. Initially the straight style of shoulder straps were not comfortable at all. Such a fine tweak, but made all the difference. The pack is laying at an angle, so it all looks wonkier than it is.
Found a 1.5lt iced tea bottle from Aldi was the gear. Tried different sized bottles. Nalgene silo (1.5lt) was a no go as it interfered with my arm swing, anything 1lt fit fine, but I like 3lt capacity so finding a 1.5 x 2 that worked was important.

All in all, I enjoyed the company on the walk this morning, I didn't even really notice the pack at all which has to be good. There were some steep bits that we scrabbled up, I felt balanced and unimpeded.
Quite surprising amount of ventilation on my back due to the way the harness sits. Hip belt delightful, pockets easy to zip/unzip and fit a lot in. I can reach my drink bottles unassisted and with no shoulder dislocation. Getting them back in took a few attempts but got better at it. No even vaguely sore spots anywhere on my body- hurrah.

Just need to add my food bag in for the upcoming adventure and am good to go. I did purchase the optional 4lt 'trash and treasure' bag that OP makes for those times where I need a smidge extra capacity, but now I am fully loaded I can see I probably won't actually need it.

[Lamont]

Va Va Voom!
Looks a treat!
The bottle pockets near the hip line transfer the weight nicely to the hip belt it seems.
Nice stable and adjustable harness, winner.
Tramp on!

[stry]

Oh - Mrs. Mudd. Not only did our pack fit universes seem to align on the topic of Aarn, but now you have bought what has been tempting me for some time - the Canopy. And it works for you

I have for quite a few years been using the now discontinued OP Shadow. Light canvas and a bit over 53 litres IIRC. 1.8kg also IIRC.

The Canopy is very attractive to me as I feel the harness could be an improvement, and I would save 300/400 grams. I also like having two over the top straps instead of one. Sanity, however, suggests that those gains would not justify the cost of a change for me .

I'll continue to watch your journey with interest.

[slparker]

Yes, nice purchase MM, I have the OP overshadow - similar pack but the water bottle holder placement on the canopy is a definite improvement.

[Ms_Mudd]

Stry, it has taken a bit of fiddling to get the shoulder straps right for me, as they were quite straight for the female form. There is so much scope for simple adjustment though with the exact fit mid harness, that after trial and error I got it 'just so'. Extremely comfortable on. It looks like the Over Shadow was a great pack, I am not sure how OP have lightened the Canopy up so much though from the Shadow (is it all in the harness?) as the Canopy feels so robust and like it should weight more than 1.4kg. The only bit of mesh on the whole thing at the front is super strong and thick too. How funny that us with our similar body types have settled on the same kinda system.

slparker, yes I loved the waterbottle holders! I was initially frustrated as I didn't think I could put 1.5lt in without it annoying me, but the Aldi Ice Tea 1.5lts are just made for it, not in my way at all and easy to get to. Oooh and I can fit my Nemo Switchback neatly in the low profile side pockets which are at the more traditional location on the side of the pack, it is just the perfect length pack too, no overhang, just slots in neatly there. I only need that mat in Winter anyway, but still great that it works.

Bit of relief really. It is the nature of living where I do, that trying before I buy is seldom an option, sometimes you have to kiss a few frogs before you find your Prince

[stry]

The OP water bottle carriers are perfectly placed for weight distribution and a slim pack profile, and are easy to access for bottle REMOVAL; but I defy anyone to replace a bottle without removing the pack. If any one has a secret, I'd love to hear it.

The trade off is worthwhile for me.

[Ms_Mudd]

The OP water bottle carriers are perfectly placed for weight distribution and a slim pack profile, and are easy to access for bottle REMOVAL; but I defy anyone to replace a bottle without removing the pack. If any one has a secret, I'd love to hear it.

hee hee hee, I did it yesterday. Is there a prize?
Actually, I just did it again right now before hitting submit on this post to make sure I wasn't talking rubbish

Say I am replacing the bottle on the left hand side pocket. I use mt L hand to hold pocket out and replace the bottle with my right hand, reaching under my L arm. If that makes sense? Husband is in the shed, so could go out and ask him to snap a pic if needed. He probably wouldn't even wonder why.
Getting the bottle out is a one handed/one sided affair though.

Just did it again to be sure. Yep it works.