Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

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Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Sat 21 Jan, 2023 10:41 am

Hello! First post on here, apologies if this isn't the right place for this!

Last weekend I did an overnight hike in the Southern Ranges, a Pindar's Peak return. Day one was Mystery Creek to Ooze Lake via Pindar's Peak, over 25kms and 1800m in elevation gain. Backed up with an 18km (700m^) walk back on day two.

I've done some shorter overnight hikes before, but this felt like my first proper adventure. It was really tough, but I achieved what I set out to (getting up Pindar's) and made it home alive. And I had a "good" time haha in very much a type 2 fun kind of way, which I gather is the only way in the Southwest! Weather was mint, which obviously makes a big difference down there. Absolutely blown away by the landscape, so impressive!

To the point of this post. For those who've hiked in the Southern Ranges, and also hiked the hard trails of Tasmania, like Arthurs, Anne etc, how does this area compare? I see warnings on the Mt Anne circuit on the PWS site that give me second thoughts about attempting it. Looking at the circuit on a map, the whole thing comes out at about the same distance and elevation as day one of my Pindar's trek, not that I want to do it in a day, but what are the factors that make this hike more challenging than getting out to Pindar's and back?

Just trying to gauge how confident I should be in my physical ability, what kind of walks can I confidently attempt next, what kind of distances can I expect to cover etc.

Thanks for your input!
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby bumpingbill » Sat 21 Jan, 2023 12:38 pm

Seems like you walked to Pindars in a day, camped at Ooze and then walked out again - that's very good going in terms of distance, speed and elevation gain. How do you think you pulled up afterwards? Were you wiped out for a week? Or could you have done more the next day?

Everyone else is going to have different opinions, but I think if you've managed Pindars return in one night, then the Anne circuit and the Arthurs shouldn't worry you too much in terms of physical effort.

FWIW, you don't need to summit Anne if you think it's too hard. It is skip-able. Feel free to go have a look when you walk past to Shelf Camp and judge for yourself. You'll know when you get there. That said, it's good to err on the side of caution. There was a terrible accident up there fairly recently. It's all about the risks you're personally willing to take - only you know that.

Did you manage Pindars no worries? From memory there's one little bit that requires a little bit of a harder than normal climb?

I ask that because you do need to handle The Notch, which comes down to your experience and threshold for a little bit of exposure and ability to scramble and climb up several meters. Look up some pics of "the notch tasmania" to see what I mean. There's been a few discussions here in recent times about it too.

Arthurs is longer in terms of days, but these days I'd say it's all fairly pedestrian. There are a few sections where it's steep or scrubby or requires scrambling and/or pack hauling/etc, but I think pretty manageable for someone who's done Pindars

Obviously I'm talking good conditions: when the weather turns bad, it all gets much harder, more dangerous and less fun.

Side note but I would recommend a light 10 meter rope for both those walks to haul your pack though if you do Anne circuit and/or Western Arthurs - I find scrambling/climbing without it and pulling the pack up/down after makes it *much* easier.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Sat 21 Jan, 2023 2:51 pm

This is great thanks for replying!

Seems like you walked to Pindars in a day, camped at Ooze and then walked out again - that's very good going in terms of distance, speed and elevation gain. How do you think you pulled up afterwards? Were you wiped out for a week? Or could you have done more the next day?


Yeah correct, thanks!

I was sore no doubt, but I did go for a short walk (4kms) the day after to keep things moving. I think if I was doing a 5+ day hike and only one of those days was as big as that Pindar day, I'd be fine. If there were several 25km+ days I'd want to work on fitness, which I'm doing anyway. I'm hoping to get to the point where that sort of day is not a big deal, but it's a work in progress!

Did you manage Pindars no worries? From memory there's one little bit that requires a little bit of a harder than normal climb?


Yeah I thought it was very straightforward. The final 100m or so has some scrambling, one step in particular that requires hands to climb. There's also no really exposed sections.

Good to know about the notch, something to research. From a preliminary google it looks fine, and I have some experience with exposure, recently climbing Table Mtn via the Hiddingh-Ascention route which includes some very exposed scrambling/climbing.

Obviously I'm talking good conditions: when the weather turns bad, it all gets much harder, more dangerous and less fun.


Yeah for sure. I had perfect weather for Pindars, and it hadn't rained recently so the quagmire's were at a minimum. It's really all downhill from there weather-wise!

Thanks again!
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby bumpingbill » Sat 21 Jan, 2023 5:10 pm

No worries!

FWIW, the Notch is much harder that the Pindar's bit, and I think Anne is harder than The Notch.

Only mentioned it in case you found Pindars hard/iffy - then you'd want more experience elsewhere.

That's just my scale. Others may disagree.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Sun 22 Jan, 2023 12:21 pm

Wicked thanks again. Happy with much harder, love a good bit of scrambling so I'll look forward to that.

And understand, I'll not know how it fits for me til I'm out there, but just wanted another opinion to help gauge my preparedness. Thanks for your input!
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby north-north-west » Mon 23 Jan, 2023 4:46 pm

Anne circuit has a far better track than Southern Range as far as Pindars. There are a few more scranbly bits - Southern Range doesn't really get scrambly, it's more just patches of steep walking with a lot of trying to work out where the track/pad is. There's also a patch of boulder ballet on the way to Anne, which doesn't really happen in the Southern Range until you're on the far side of PB. But on the circuit, The Notch and one drop on the approach to it are the only tricky bits, and both of those can be bypassed, although that is easier said than done. Apart from those two - and the summit climb itself - it's fairly easy going.

Sometimes the warning signs are more about the clueless hordes who attempt the walk than the difficulty of the walk itself.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Mon 23 Jan, 2023 5:52 pm

All of that sounds perfect, I enjoy getting on the rocks, and am an aspiring rock climber too, so the more scrambling the better.

I get that about the warnings, the registration page warning seemed more targeted at more experienced walkers though!

· The Mt Anne Circuit is a highly advanced multiday Grade 5 - wilderness track and is considered to be more challenging than other multi-day walks in Tasmania such as the Overland Track and Frenchmans Cap. Walkers should gain experience in other walks in Tasmania before attempting this walk.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby north-north-west » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 9:07 am

It''s well-known and it's spectacular. That makes it popular with the Instagrammers, many of whom are not capable of properly assessing either their own capabilities or the difficulties of a proposed route.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby wander » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 12:24 pm

The route Mystery Creek to Pinders is straight forward in that it is a formed and marked track. There is a little overgrowth on the the Hill One climb and the Maxwell Ridge to Ooze Lake section, but head down and push on gets thru. It is possible to navigate it in poor weather / low viz.

The only scramble is the final climb to Pinders.

So I submit it's not that difficult a route. It's a whisker more challenging from Pinders thru to PB and then SCT.

Your effort to do Pinders out and back in 2 days with an overnight however is an very awesome effort.

I have been thru the PB Loop 3 times, 1999/2000, 2013 and 2022/2023.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 2:46 pm

So I submit it's not that difficult a route.


Yeah I would agree, I didn't have too much trouble finding/following the route. Though I did lose it a couple times through inattention, it was easy to get back on track.

How do you think it compares to other walks you've done in Tasmania? Is it on the easier end of the spectrum?

Your effort to do Pinders out and back in 2 days with an overnight however is an very awesome effort.

I have been thru the PB Loop 3 times, 1999/2000, 2013 and 2022/2023.


Thanks a bunch!

When you say the loop, was that continuing down to the SCT and back along the coast? I heard that the PB to SCT section is mostly just wading through the shallows of the lagoon, is that accurate/fun? Getting over to PB is definitely on my list.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby dis » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 4:42 pm

I finished the entire loop solo earlier this year. I was up on PB on the 1st January 2023. I have posted a short trip description and video in the trip report forum.

In regards to the wade, I really enjoyed it. It was a nice change to the majority of the walking over the Southern Ranges (took about 3.5 hours from Cavern Camp to the Prion Beach boat crossing). Dropping down to the Lagoon from PB is a long and steep descent - 1100m over ~4km or so.

In a whole, I found the Southern Ranges to be more challenging than the Western Arthurs. Whilst the Western Arthurs is more scrambling, the scrub after Pandani Knob is pretty thick and overall the walking over the entire range I found was of a harder grade - although this may be due to being solo and limited water after Ooze Lake.

I am yet to do Mt Anne, but its high on my list for my next trek in Tassie.

Good stuff getting out to Pindars Peak, its a fantastic peak!
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby north-north-west » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 5:22 pm

Cavern to Prion depends on the water level. If there's been a lot of rain (as in the 36 hours I was stuck at Leaning *expletive deleted* Tea Tree Saddle the first time I did the loop) the wade down the lagoon can take a day or more. Waiting for it to drop some more is the main reason I stayed at Cavern Camp that trip; it dropped another six inches overnight and the next morning's walk down to Prion was quite easy.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 8:06 pm

Wicked @dis, just checked your trip report out, even more keen to get around the loop now, looks incredible. Couple big days in there, nice one!

@north-north-west, I'm picturing Leaning Tea Tree Saddle as a longer version of the Maxwell Ridge-Ooze section, is that ballpark?
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby north-north-west » Tue 24 Jan, 2023 8:22 pm

thombsaway wrote:@north-north-west, I'm picturing Leaning Tea Tree Saddle as a longer version of the Maxwell Ridge-Ooze section, is that ballpark?


Not really. It's a shallow, soggy saddle, maybe 300m long, with s*&^%$#a shelter, little vegetation except sedge and the aforementioned tea tree, and prone to some truly diabolical weather. The tea tree doesn't so much lean as virtually lie down, because it's always getting blasted by the wind. Unfortunately, it's also one of realtively few spots where you can camp between Pandani Knob and Wylly Plateau, and the only one with reliable water between Ooze and Wylly Plateau.

Not the first or last place I've been weathered in, but definitely the most annoying. At one point the wind dropped and the sky started to brighten so I started packing up and was about to pull the tent down when the wind came right back, just as strong as before but from the opposite direction, and blew all the rotten weather right back at me.

But the weather always does nasty stuff to me down there. Nearly got blown off the top PB last time I did the circuit. Took three visits to finally get a view from La Perouse.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby wander » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 8:53 am

When you say the loop, was that continuing down to the SCT and back along the coast? I heard that the PB to SCT section is mostly just wading through the shallows of the lagoon, is that accurate/fun? Getting over to PB is definitely on my list.



The rest of the PB loop has a couple more issues than the Mystery Creek to Pinders part.

From Pinders to Pandani Knob has cairns.

From Pandani Knob to Leaning Tree Saddle now has scrub to over head high, this has a good track at ground level but where it goes thru pandani section great care needs to be taken to pick up the trail on the other side.
Mt Wylly has way too many cairns and in poor viz a person could be lead astray, in normal conditions it's straight forward, the tarns at Wylly Plateau are now pretty close to filled with growth (normal process in alpine landscape) so water is from the spring/stream on Wylly. This is the only reliable water until 1/3 the way up PB.

Wylly to PB is good track, just keep the head down to follow it here and there.

Up PB is enough cairns and footpad. It's a bit slippery in the wet but no real issues.

Down PB has a very steep route with quite a few person high vertical drops. Not enough to pack haul but you do need to be able to lower yourself and pack with your arms. But none of it is really exposed like sections of the EAs about Fedders.

Once down the steep section the trail follows a ridge to New River Lagoon. This trail is taped and had been freshly taped (maybe by Parks as there was a new track monitoring marker; numbered stainless steel tag; at the top of the track). If you lose the tapes you must go back and get back on the taped route. Most sections of the forest do not allow a foot pad to persist with leaf & bark & tree fall so the foot pad regularly disappears. It would be a world of slow pain to make your own way thru the forest to New river Lagoon. Plenty of tree yoga and tree limbo on this section of the route.

In three trips I've not had any issues with wade down the Lagoon. I've been lucky to have warm days with typically a tail wind, the water has been at the regular level so wading 95% of the time. It would not be as much fun on a wet day or if the Lagoon was up as noted by others above.

Once on the SCT it's a doddle. Last trip we went West for a change and flew out of Melaleuca.

So in summary I'd say the Pinders to PB to SCT section is a little more challenging than the Mystery Creek to Pinders section but not grossly so.

Last trip we did at a gentleman's pace with a rest/side trip day at Pigsty Ponds and a rest/tent day at Wylly knowing the forecast (taken from top of La Perouse) was for rain (lots) and gale that day. This proved the be the right call, it was a rum old day. We also stopped at Cavern Camp to do the Lagoon to Tura Beach camp the next day. I generally try and plan that wandering will stop mid arvo to be able to spend the rest of the day enjoying a location rather than pulling long days on my feet.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby thombsaway » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 11:56 am

Thanks for your description of the rest of the loop @wander!

Can I just ask about the wading, not something I've had to do before. How deep is the water you're walking through for the most part? Do you need to prepare for a wet pack and drybag things? Assuming you'd take boots off too?
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby dis » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 12:01 pm

Leaning Tee Tree saddle is definitely not a great place to camp - ignore Chapman's reference to great camping here. It was pretty soggy through here but obviously a good place to refill your water from the semi-permanent pool.
Smiths Saddle was a full on bog when I went through.

I think camping at either Ooze Lake or Pandani Knob (if you carry additional water), and then pushing through to Wylly Plateau is the best choice.

Also coming off PB, the last 100m of vertical descent or so is through Limestone with large sink holes - so extra care is required here.

thombsaway wrote:Thanks for your description of the rest of the loop @wander!

Can I just ask about the wading, not something I've had to do before. How deep is the water you're walking through for the most part? Do you need to prepare for a wet pack and drybag things? Assuming you'd take boots off too?


You'll want to wade at low tide. You stick close to the shore and it is generally around ankle to knee height (these conditions can obviously change depending on recent rainfall). There are a couple of creeks that you have to wade past (some up to your waist), and its best to either find the sandbar or go inland (and cross logs) to skip these.

There are rocks and logs underneath, so you definitely want to keep your boots on. The water is tanin stained so hiking / wading poles are very useful (as you can't see what is below you).

Generally best to prepare your pack for water, in-case you fall in.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby wander » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 2:15 pm

thombsaway wrote:Can I just ask about the wading, not something I've had to do before. How deep is the water you're walking through for the most part? Do you need to prepare for a wet pack and drybag things? Assuming you'd take boots off too?


The bulk of the wade is ankle deep in normal conditions. The first km includes lots of stretches of rocky bottom which is hard on most peoples feet, I just wore my boots, the rock were too hard on bare feet.

The wet boots are not an issue later, you slowly get them dry over a couple of days wandering and wring out of socks.

The only deep stretch was past Chapman/McKay Creek outflow. You can go inland to cross on a log which I recollect doing on previous trips down the Lagoon but we found we could just wade, this trip for me it was up to my waist. My wandering partner is 6"2 so it helps to send him to the front at times like creek crossings. We did not do anything special with our packs which were Hyperlight Sherpas so we were expecting they would do the job. Everything is normally dry bagged inside these packs anyhow as well. The packs did not leak on this brief test.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby Tortoise » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 2:27 pm

wander wrote:The wet boots are not an issue later, you slowly get them dry over a couple of days wandering and wring out of socks.
You happily aren't one who gets bad blisters under such circumstances. :?
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby north-north-west » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 3:23 pm

thombsaway wrote:Can I just ask about the wading, not something I've had to do before. How deep is the water you're walking through for the most part? Do you need to prepare for a wet pack and drybag things? Assuming you'd take boots off too?


Leave your boots on or take shoes just for the wade. You'll be slipping and sliding all over the place otherwise because much of the bottom is rocky and often covered with algae. Best to remove trousers, however.
Low tide and normal water levels, there are some stretches of shoreline you can walk on, especially closer to cavern Camp. One creek, as dis has said, is best crossed inland via one of the big logs that invariably fall down in this sort of country.

Both times I've done it, the deepest stretch was past one of the larger creeks and that was barely mid thigh - and I'm a bit of a shortarse.

Take polarising sunnies to help see the bottom; particularly good if you're doing it on a sunny day.
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Re: Help putting difficulty in perspective, Southern Ranges

Postby Lostsoul » Wed 25 Jan, 2023 3:29 pm

Tortoise wrote:
wander wrote:The wet boots are not an issue later, you slowly get them dry over a couple of days wandering and wring out of socks.
You happily aren't one who gets bad blisters under such circumstances. :?

Wetsuit shoes are the go,light and dry quick.I use them as camp shoes,they still have rubber grippy soles.
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