Beginner questions and Sleeping solutions...

[Orch]

Hey guys,

Im looking to get some gear, Im not experienced in hiking or anything but love the outdoors and bushwalks and want to do some days and short treks with some friends. I have been lurking on this site and a few others for some time now and have got stumped on what I think are 3 important essential items... Sleeping bag, tent and pack.

The more that I look into information on sleeping bags the more I get confused or disheartened, I just cant seem to find something that I think would suit my need/budget and dont really know much about 'higher end' sleeping bags. I say higherend because I have a sleeping bag that I have used since I was about 10 but it packs down to the size of a large dog and weighs about the same...

Weight is VERY important to me, im not an 'Ultralight nut' but just a small guy - 5'4" (163cm) 60kg and slowly improving my fitnes. From my reading I think I need to get a down bag with about a 500-600 loft giving me a comfort rating of -2 - -6 and weighing as close to 1kg or less as possible. Im pretty sure im a cold sleeper. I want to use this bag in winter but not snow (if I ever did go snow I would determine the possibility of adding more layers or so on but I think my temp range is right.). Is this possible at a budget of $300? (again as close to or less than)

So that brings me to the tent issue, I dont need to take it into snow storms but I dont want it leaking or breaking in strong winds and epic rain storms. Although I will mostly be going by my self (or sleeping by myself) it would be nice to have the option of being able to squeeze someone in there, most likely a female companion so I dont need a spacious 2 man, a small 2man or 1.5man I had thought... Again though I just dont know what im looking at when it comes to tents, I think tunnels are up with the best for wind resistance is this still the case? Im not too sure about the ground sheeting and realise that I would quite possibly need an additional ground sheeting if I was expecting heavy rain. My budget for a tent is about the same although I would probably want to make a sacrifice here if I could spending less money. Again weight is a big issue.

Finally packs are something that I have looked at but not been able to determine what would be 'best' I think that I would be looking at 50-60L maximum and would only be carrying a load of 10-13kg. While looking at packs I have come to the conclusion that I would be needing to look at lighter packs without comprimising too much on durability as I feel that a pack that is over 2kg is really a waste of supply weight.

Im really looking for good reccomendations on brands/shops that I could get gear from and any advice on anything would be really appreciated.

Orch.

[sthughes]

For a sleeping bag you could get this one http://www.campsaver.com/itemMatrix.asp?groupcode=mar0042&MatrixType=1 at the moment for about 10% over your budget. It might be a tad more expensive but it is a good 850 loft bag and a bit warmer than you are after. This extra warmth might let you go to a full mesh inner tent design, greatly increasing the options, especially in the cheaper lines.

Either way look for a bag rated to EN standards or a least one that quotes fill weights and loft ratings and compare these to bags which are EN rated. Of course bags are rated on still air environments so a full mesh tent in wind will decrease the supposed warmth.

A $300, two man, light weight tent of good quality is a bit hard to come by, although there are a few options online. Campsaver have the Hubba Hubba on sale at the moment for not a lot more than that, which is a good deal. I'm talking two man because if you want to share then unless you are a fan of contortion-ism then a 1.5 man will not be fun, probably fine while actually sleeping but trying to get changed or anything with two people would be something you really wouldn't choose to do in my opinion, especially in rain or with lots of condensation.

As for packs these are a very personal thing as to your exact shape, hence it needs to be tried on. Personally if I were you I'd look at the 2010 One Planet Shadow at the sort of size/weight you are after. You will be hard pressed to find a One Planet user (such as myself) that isn't happy, but of course try it on as there is the occasional person it just wont be comfortable on.
That's my 2c

[Franco]

Just a tip on sleeping warm.
It seems to me that all too often people focus on the sleeping bag and forget about a mat. You need a mat that matches your bag.
(try sleeping on top of your bushwalking mat on the floor at home having on top the same blankets you have on your bed)
Franco

[Son of a Beach]

There's a fairly comprehensive sleeping bag selection page on the wiki that may be of interest. Apart from general information, it includes a tabular comparison of dozens of bags as of last year some time.

[Orch]

thanks for the great reply sthughes, at that price I dont think I can go past that bag after looking further into it. As for the tent - URGH! just complicates things too much, again compared to the price of the hubba hubba here its a great deal but may put off the tent for now as I have a mate wiht a 2 man ill be going with for now so I think I can safely postpone it for now.

I think I read something about the shadow last night and had a look at it online, and from everything everyone says I wouldnt be as silly as to buy a pack without fitting it first for comfort, I think ill head into a store this week and try it on.

Franco very good point and Im aware I need to get a good quality mat, just trying to figure out bag first then mat will come... in itself it does raise quite the problem, I dont really want one that I have to blow up which leaves self inflators and internal pump (like the mont delux) also light weight... so yeah... see what happens :/

[Franco]

Orch
"I dont really want one that I have to blow up which leaves self inflators and internal pump (like the mont delux) also light weight... so yeah... see what happens "

I am curious to know why...
I will not comment on your reply because there is no right or wrong , I just would like to know ...

Of the solid foam a very popular (and affordable) is the Thermarest Z Lite. A beefier version is the Ridgrest available in 1.5 and 2cm (Deluxe now "solar")
A version that is somewhat between the two Ridgerest in size and that even I can tolerate is the one on the far right of my picture, not commonly available but I did buy that in Melbourne.
Kind of an egg crate "blue mat" with a 2mm rubber bottom. ($29?)
Franco

as you can see I have no problems at all about choosing mats.

[sthughes]

Lol - looks like you have no problem choosing mats, but a bit of difficulty choosing A mat!
Look how small that Neo Air is
Be interesting to see the almost inverse relationship of packed size to price

[Orch]

Franco, I think it has to do with effort after a long hard day. Self inflators are the winner here, unscrew and throw them down. Its actually made me think what would require more effort the exped delux or Neoair... I have seen the Neoair in quite a few write ups and in your picture it is VERY tempting, who knows.. pack size and weight it is a winner all over... You said you wouldnt comment on my reason, but please do have you counted how many regular breaths it takes to blow up? your thoughts on having to blow it up?

[Franco]

The Neo Air is most often criticised for not doing what it wasn't designed for... fancy that.
By that I mean that so many can't help themselves pointing out that it isn't any good below zero.
Yes we know that....hence the R2.5 rating.

End of rant.

When I first got the Neo Air I did count the breaths that it takes me to blow it up , but have since forgotten.
In fact my two walking mates had one each too so we compared. All I remember is that it was about the same (3 non smokers...)
So I have just done that again for you. About 20. Oddly I remembered that as I was doing it...
One point to keep in mind is that if your load is light enough , you may be less tired when you arrive at camp.
It takes me about half an hour to pitch my tent, blow the mat up, spread my sleeping bag, get some water , wash myself , sort out my dinner
and then have a look at others fiddling with their tents
Franco

[sthughes]

Franco, I think it has to do with effort after a long hard day. Self inflators are the winner here, unscrew and throw them down. Its actually made me think what would require more effort the exped delux or Neoair... I have seen the Neoair in quite a few write ups and in your picture it is VERY tempting, who knows.. pack size and weight it is a winner all over... You said you wouldnt comment on my reason, but please do have you counted how many regular breaths it takes to blow up? your thoughts on having to blow it up?

18 breaths for the regular size one - but then I do play the tuba so that helps
Blowing it up doesn't bother me at all, better than pumping up a downmat in my opinion. My Prolite 4 always takes at least a couple of breaths anyway, not that I've used it at all since getting the Neo. And the comfort of the Neo kills any comparable self inflater, so the effort is totally worth it.
Have happily slept on snow with mine, just shoved my spare fleece and wet weather gear under it (don't know if it was necessary or not).

[Drifting]

I'd look into a Pacific Outdoor Ether THermo 3/4 mat- around 600g and insulated. Around $100 Aus. A Mountain Hardwear Lamina 20 Bag (you could get the woman's size, it's a bit warmer apparently)- around 1kg, and under $200 from the US. My wife has one and loves it. THe combination of those two would certainly set you up for 3 seasons in the Alps. That's your sleeping squared away for under 2kg. Throw in a good lightweight pack (no, you shouldn't have to spend $500) and a good tent, and you're good to go. Consider the Scarp1 from Tarptent in the US- go for the 4-season model. It's around 1.7kg from memory, with the extra poles. Cost you around $325 US from memory.

A lot of locally manufactured gear is too dear for casual users IMHO. Almost all of my gear comes from the US, though I do buy local if I can get comparable prices here.

[ninjapuppet]

I want to use this bag in winter but not snow. Is this possible at a budget of $300? (again as close to or less than)

Orch.

mate, you're in luck.

get it before some other gear nut here gets it. its about half price

https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1jUoVAR18dYRFlrlgowlWcf8AZovaji--XTG3JHb1WSk

[ninjapuppet]

but please do have you counted how many regular breaths it takes to blow up? your thoughts on having to blow it up?

http://www.themillair.com/index.html


this $3.99 device makes your comment redundant

[Franco]

Still waiting for some reports on that "pump"
I am starting to think that i should make my own , except that I doubt very much I can do it for $4 . (postage ?)

That "can't be bothered at the end of the day..." is actually very common with through hikers. (too knackered after 30 miles day in day out...)
Franco

[sailfish]

You may be able to get end of winter sale items now that people will be looking more at warmer weather gear and shops want of off load what is unlikely to sell now. I got a new prolight4 that way on Oztion for much less than normal retail. The other thing is to itemise all the gear you want with documented best prices you can find. Take your list around the shops, some will undercut for a job lot sale. The more items, (higher value) the better the deal.

Regards,
Ken