starting from the backpack..

[ditomagico]

HI All,

I'm started planning for the Overland track at the end of 2022 or early 2023 ( if I will be lucky/quick enough to find spots available ) so as first thing I'm looking to buy a good backpack.. and looking for suggestions in size and brand/model. I'm happy to invest on a good product made to last so price is not really a constrain. I started doing some research and size wise the general opinion is that a 75 lt should be enough?
I may do it by myself so I need to consider the possibility to not be able to share the load with anyone. Want to buy it as soon as possible and to start using it this season for other hikes and get comfortable with it. If it matters, I'm 6" tall.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Simon

[Aardvark]

With a large pack such as you require, you're really buying a harness with a bag attached. In saying that i mean to suggest you consider the right fit first. Just like you would do with boots. Chances are, with your height you will get a longer size in terms of back length.
Most of the weight should be directed to your hips, so the hip belt needs to be strong enough to spread the weight evenly and not collapse so as to focus all the weight on the centre line of the belt.
The decision on brand and price should be amongst the packs you decide first to have the right support and fit.
Any decent store will help you with the fit. Try not to get railroaded into a particular brand or price.

[ditomagico]

Thanks Aardvark for the advice .Next week I'm planning to go in Melbourne CBD hiking shops and start trying some backpack.

[Moondog55]

So I have to ask if you already have some gear?
What I usually advise people is to get all of the gear you are going to need for the trip in one place and make sure the rucksack picked can fit it all plus a space for food.fuel and other consumables.
Any good shop should be able to help you determine that volume of gear, but if you already had a bulky synthetic sleeping bag you wanted to use, that might colour the decision on a slightly bigger pack

[ChrisJHC]

Agree with Moondog.

But, if you want to look at a specific pack, Paddy Palin have the Osprey Aether 70 on sale.

A very good all-round pack that will easily carry your gear for the OLT.

[markg]

EXO, US. The most comfortable pack for carrying just about anything. Bit exxy though.

[JohnnoMcJohnno]

I have started thinking about the Overland track again myself. I have worked out that my 55 litre pack is probably just too small even with lightweight gear and I may have to invest in something a bit bigger. 70 litres would work for me but as others have said it depends how bulky your stuff is.

Packs are such a specific fit though it's difficult to recommend one in particular. You need to get something that fits your torso length, your shoulder width, and that feels right to you. The best thing is to try a few on yourself at one of the specialist stores, get them to load it up with weight, and walk around in the store with it for a bit. Give it a good go in the store - I've tried some packs which feel great when you first put them on only for everything to start stretching and sagging and feeling miserable after a bit. Good luck with your searching.

[nezumi]

I would echo and reinforce the comments that have already been made - the backpack should ideally be one of the last purchases you make, not one of the first.

You want to have the smallest bag that is viable for your gear - any extra space inevitably gets filled with *something*, so keeping the bag size as low as possible is a good way of countering this. Bags also carry loads best when they are full - it reduces shifting of items internally. Once you have your essential gear, if you can take it with you to the shop you are buying the pack from, it will allow you to do a proper test pack on the bag. This will help identify any issues in the way the bag sits/carries that might not be apparent using only weight bags.

[ChrisJHC]

You want to have the smallest bag that is viable for your gear - any extra space inevitably gets filled with *something*, so keeping the bag size as low as possible is a good way of countering this.

I’ve always struggled with this concept.
I have a gear list that I use religiously (actually a few gear lists based on the type of hike I’m doing). I think most people do the same.
Not sure why I would suddenly add in extra stuff just because I have a bigger pack.

[Son of a Beach]

I started doing some research and size wise the general opinion is that a 75 lt should be enough?

It really depends on what gear you have. When I started doing extended bushwalks (decades ago), I would have required about 75 litres to fit it all in.

But these days, I have gear that is much lighter and much more compact. I have done some fairly long walks with a 50 litre pack (and I'm certainly NOT an ultra-light walker). However, I have since decided that was a bit of a squish, and too difficult to fit it all in, and have now settled on a 60 litre pack, which is more than enough for a week-long walk.

I still have an 80 litre pack, but very rarely use it. It's significantly heavier, even without any extra gear in it.

So the size of you pack depends very much on what gear you are going to take. If you are able to acquire compact gear (which will cost more if you want good quality), then 75 litres would be overkill, and will be heavier than necessary. But if you are trying to avoid spending more money, or if you have older or less compact gear, then 75 litres may be about right (but will still be heavier).

[Moondog55]

I'm going to insert a word or two here.
Much depends on season and what size clothing you wear and clothing/comfort choices.
If you are a bit cautious in your planning, wear synthetic clothing and are of larger than average size and are packing for snow conditions you will need a much larger pack than a person who wears a size medium regular, only uses down insulation of high quality, has good bones and can sleep on a minimal mattress and usually travels in mild conditions.
I'm an XL to XXL in clothing so all my gear is a bit larger and heavier, also a little older and less able to sleep directly on cold hard ground and want/need some extra cushioning.
While I can get my summer gear into a 75 litre pack I can only get in enough food for a short trip if I also need to carry water. My winter pack therefore is one of those aforementioned 110 litre monsters.
You don't need to fill a large pack; although it requires discipline to only take just what you need but you can't fit winter gear and winter food into a small pack, so if you can only afford one pack my advice is to go larger rather than smaller.
Personal opinion but based on a bit of experience on skis and snowshoes and temperatures as low as -30C a couple of times

[peregrinator]

The comments from Moondog and Son of a Beach indicate to me that there are very good reasons to consider an Aarn pack. Note, I have no commercial affiliation with that company or any retailer selling their products. The fact is that Aarn's front pockets and backpack combination make for a very flexible system, capable of carrying widely variable loads.

There may be pros and cons, just as with any product; you be the judge. Ditomagico, if you are visiting Melbourne, check out: https://www.backpackinglight.com.au/brands/aarn/

Edit: Sorry, just read the Who Are You? section and learnt that you are based in Melbourne.

[headwerkn]

Agree with the others. Unless you're restricted to a certain weight/load because of back/medical issues you really want to decide on your major items first - tent, sleeping system, wet weather gear etc. - as they'll determine how large a pack you'll require (or if you prefer, how small a pack you can get away with!).

70L is a pretty typical "standard" capacity... I did my first OLT trip with an old 70L Mountain Designs Trekker... but these days you can do it in a lot less with the right gear (and not too much of it).

[Aardvark]

Compression straps on packs allow you to make a big bag smaller but you can't make a small bag bigger.
I would always recommend you try to pack everything inside your bag rather than have add ons. My reasoning there is that you can reduce the risk of losing items or having them torn off. Things hanging on packs only increases the chance of vegetation or rocks catching them as you pass.
I always laugh when on TV they show people with sleeping bags hanging from below the pack. That's TV for you. They never break away from the cliched image of a bushwalker or hiker. How long did they persist with the metal H frame external harness. I still have one of those from when i was a kid.

[JohnnoMcJohnno]

How long did they persist with the metal H frame external harness. I still have one of those from when i was a kid.

Steady on. I still regularly use my H frame. Awesome pack for carrying heavy loads.

[Moondog55]

H-Frame from Macpac is still my summer pack, all 65/75 litres of it

[ditomagico]

HI All

thanks a lot for your advice. This afternoon I spend some time around shops trying backpacks and also started exploring other items such tent , sleeping bag and mattress.

So far I tried the below packs with 12/14 kg load.. walk around and did some steps. They are in order of preference for feeling/comfort

- One Planet STXY - 70 lt - 2.9 kg - canvas -only think I didn't like (aside the price ) is that there is no side access to the main pocket so loading /unloading is only from the top
- Lowe Alpine cerro torre 65-85 - 2.9kg - nylon - felt quite robust and with a good weight distribution on the hip. I like that it has a detachable 15 lt backpack and main pocket side access. also can be set as a 65 or an 85 lt
- DEUTER AIRCONTACT 65+10 - 2.54kg - nylon - felt good quality but not as comfortable like the above ones
- Aether Plus 70L - 2.6kg - nylon - felt very thin and tall - felt ok on the hips but building quality felt below the above ones a lot of zips and pockets .. may be too many?? more thing can break ?
- another one that I don't remember the bran .. very light but wasn't comfortable.

I'll definitely check the Aarn and the Exo.

Tent:
I saw in display the :
- One planet - Goondie 2 - nylon inner and polyester fly - 1.96kg - like the bathtub floor and it feel quite robust
- MONT MOONDANCE 2 TENT W FULL NYLON INNER - 2.02kg - floor seems a bit light compare to the one planet

any other tent suggestion?

Sleeping bag
One planet shop assistance did OLD twice and suggested to use a -4 comfort rating. I tried the Bungle -10 a tapered rectangular down fill bag - 1.1kg - it looks well done and is locally made - this is an item that I'm happy to spend money on. Good rest for me is priceless...
any other good brands/ model you can suggest? MAcPAc

Mattress
I tried the Yhermarest Trail pro regular wide . 7.8cm R-value 4.4 and 1Kg - found it very comfortable and not noisie!! I think I'll go with it.

thanks again for all your advices !

[wildwanderer]

Have a look at the osprey aether pro 70. Many guys find this comfortable. Doesn't have as many features as some others though but it's got large capacity, comfortable when carrying big loads, it's robust while being relatively light weight at 1.79kg.

Another good and robust option. One planet tussock. It's 60L but you can boost it to 65L with the hip belt pockets and trash and treasure add-ons.

Another aspect is your overall carrying weight. Some of the gear your looking at is quite heavy compared to other gear that is available. Eg your 1 kg mat.

Also keep in mind that for some pack manufacturers the size of the harness also impacts the total litres capacity. So in the case of a 70L pack. Size large might be 73L, medium 70L and small 67L

For sleeping bags. Look at Mont, OP and Nemo both available in Aus stores. Sea to summit bags also available but I'm not that familiar..

Macpac.. no idea.. they seem to have shifted to more mainstream travel wear/gear rather than bushwalking stuff. (Could just be me being nostalgic for the NZ made days)

Tents.
For 2p tents Mont Moondance and WE space are good choices.

Could look at a tarp tent if willing to buy OS.

[Moondog55]

HI All




Sleeping bag
One planet shop assistance did OLD twice and suggested to use a -4 comfort rating. I tried the Bungle -10 a tapered rectangular down fill bag - 1.1kg - it looks well done and is locally made - this is an item that I'm happy to spend money on. Good rest for me is priceless...

thanks again for all your advices !

So are you over 35?
Your sleeping metabolism drops as you age
Rule of thumb is to add on 5 degrees C for every decade after 35YO, which is why I now need a -25C bag in white season.
If I was buying a new OP bag it would be the Cocoon in the warmest version and persuade the factory to add 10% extra down and get it inn the highest loft they had.

[Hiking Exped]

Agree with others. Get all your kit and then select your pack. On packs some love to compress and squeeze things in, but often a pack with extra room makes things much easier. I have a Karrimor SF Predator 80-130 that I’ve used on an extensive trip. It’s very comfortable and very robust with lots of space. Not used anymore as I purchased much lighter smaller gear to save my knees and went to their Sabre 75 and then smaller still. You are welcome to borrow it or buy it. On sleeping bags consider western mountaineering, excellent bags, or PHD in the UK if you have the cash. PHD are my favourite for warmth, loft, down and weight, but expensive. I’m very impressed with a Illumina tent from Novapro sports I got early this year. It’s a lightweight 2 person 4 season or a large 1 person at 1.5 kg or 1.75 with extra footprint that comes with it. Very inexpensive and I’ve had it up on Mt Stirling in snow and heavy rain. So far so good!

[Mark7260]

I have just set myself up for a 04 jan departure, using a 50lt one planet Canopy backpack. going for 7 days.
Hilleberg Soulo BL tent, Mont brindabella xt 850 bag, S2S etherlight XT extreme mat etc etc, so you can see its not an ultralight setup, but all fits in the 50lt backpack with 2 hip belt pockets.

[ditomagico]

Hi All
thanks again to all that provided their advices. boxing day I went out for shopping and I tried the AARN ang Osprey Aether Pro

the AARN have an incredible harness but unfortunately the padding on the belts is very light and loaded with 14kg it was very uncomfortable on my chest.

At the end I bought the Osprey Aether pro (1.8KG) , a Sea to Summit Ascent 2 -10C rated (1kg) and a Nemo tensor alpine ultralight mountaineering pad (.650kg)

I also had a look at several tent and the sale assistant was super helpful. He suggest a SlingFin portal. wasn't really convinced has only mesh as inner layer so I didn't go for it

I'm now looking at the HILLEBERG ROGEN (3 season) or a HILLEBERG JANNU (4 seasons).

Anyone have experience with the Rogen?
I'm a bit worried about condensation since it doesn't have any vent on the top and relies only on the "special" fly lower profile for ventilation... hence looking to the Jannu that has a top ventilation port with a "double " fly and it should also be more durable. The Jannu on the other hand is 1.2kg heavier .

thanks

[Moondog55]

Do you plan on doing a lot of alpine winter camping?
I assume not as the AC2 is a little light for white season if you feel the cold; so maybe you don't need the extra security of the Jannu.
EDIT
As somebody a touch taller than 1840mm I find I feel more comfortable in tunnel tents, make sure you try out any tent for fit using the pad and sleeping bag you intend to use, do not buy a tent unless you fit in it comfortably. Note also that you need much more room in a white season tent
Bushwalking and Fast&Light mountaineering are very different things, I don't even fit into a couple of the better assault tents without touching both ends

[nezumi]

You want to have the smallest bag that is viable for your gear - any extra space inevitably gets filled with *something*, so keeping the bag size as low as possible is a good way of countering this.

I’ve always struggled with this concept.
I have a gear list that I use religiously (actually a few gear lists based on the type of hike I’m doing). I think most people do the same.
Not sure why I would suddenly add in extra stuff just because I have a bigger pack.

While it might not be true for all, it's a common enough occurrence that it's worth mentioning. I know that I have both experienced and observed the tendency to go down the "I might as well take it" route when planning and packing for a hike, especially with regards to spare clothing etc.

[ditomagico]

At this stage I'm not planning to do alpine winter camping.

I'd like to try but I can't find any Hilleberg sellers here in Melbourne to "test" the tent. Does anyone in Melbourne have one of those tent models and willing to show me it?
There is also the Allak model four season that has the roof ventilation.

Thanks

[wildwanderer]

At this stage I'm not planning to do alpine winter camping.

I'd like to try but I can't find any Hilleberg sellers here in Melbourne to "test" the tent. Does anyone in Melbourne have one of those tent models and willing to show me it?
There is also the Allak model four season that has the roof ventilation.

Thanks

You seem to be looking at some alpine or at least very cold temperature gear which is why moondog was asking about winter.

Consider some items such as Nemo tensor alpine is likely overkill for most Australian/new Zealand conditions where your not camping on snow. A tensor insulated would serve you well and be less weight/bulk

-10c bag also could be a bit warm. However it depends if you're a very cold sleeper or not. I am and have a -10c quilt, for me it's great for 5c to -5c conditions however anything more than 10c and I have to vent it. At 15c I'm boiling and I'm in the market for a summer weight quilt for this reason.
A -10c bag is likely warmer than a -10c quilt as quilts have no hood nor down underneath you.

For tents why are you against a mesh inner? It will be the driest and most comfortable option in majority of conditions apart from driving wind blown snow or sand. Nylon inners are warmer and more prone to condensation.

[Warin]

At this stage I'm not planning to do alpine winter camping.

You seem to be looking at some alpine or at least very cold temperature gear which is why moondog was asking about winter.

His first post says he is looking at doing the Overland Track in the booking season. While snow is possible and temperatures to -10 C the are not frequent occurrences. It is possible to also get 30 C and very bright sunshine. Welcome to Tasmania and the roaring 40s.

[north-north-west]

While I love Hilleberg tents, they are not exactly either the lightest or most practical option if you aren't going to be doing real 4-season walking or camping in very exposed places. The Jannu is definitely overkill for the OT if you're sticking to the official campsites and staying on the main track without major detours and exposed camps. While I've not seen a Rogen in the flesh, it looks like it would be more suitable and is certainly a lot lighter. The higher base to the fly, while making it less weatherproof in windier conditions, means it will breathe a bit better, although I'd still prefer a high vent as well.

[north-north-west]

For tents why are you against a mesh inner? It will be the driest and most comfortable option in majority of conditions apart from driving wind blown snow or sand. Nylon inners are warmer and more prone to condensation.

Mesh inner means condensation on the inside of the fly drips on you. Even worse if it's windy. Welcome to Tasmania.

[wildwanderer]

Mesh inner means condensation on the inside of the fly drips on you. Even worse if it's windy. Welcome to Tasmania.

That's a good point. I do like a mesh inner for most conditions but id forgotten that the full inner stops fly condensation drips.